Rabbis and Kosher-Catholic Priests in Pilpul

Pilpul, simply put, is a rabbinic dialectical process of "debate" or discussion by which a predetermined outcome is arrived at. It's the Pharisaic tradition which Jesus Christ condemned calling it a "tradition of men" which "makes void the word of God." Both the Jerusalem and Babylonian Talmuds are filled with pilpul which in most cases is for the purpose of circumventing Biblical law. The article below tells of rabbis and kosher-Catholic priests engaged in pilul for the purpose of circumventing the Gospel which condemns the very act they are engaged in. See Mark 7;13 for Christ's condemnation and Mishnah tractate Nedarim for the pilpul through which the "corban" that Christ condemned in Mark 7;13 was synthesized. And note that Jesus did not only condemn the Pharisaic "corban" invention and ritual hand washing, but He said, "many other such like things you [Pharisees] do."

Believe me when I tell you, in this "Judeo-Christian dialogue"--what is in reality pilpul--the rabbis aren't interested in hearing the Gospel. They're interested in finding ways around the Gospel, like their Pharisaic ideological forefathers found ways around Old Testament law. They intend to make the Gospel of none effect.

... if there were a transcript of the proceedings it would read very much like a discussion in the Talmud.

Rabbis and Catholic priests in dialogue

By Mark L. Shook - St. Louis Post Dispatch

June 19, 2008

The Vatican has taken great pains to define and structure religious dialogues between faith communities. As recently as June 7, Pope Benedict II spoke to the Pontifical Council for Inter-religious Dialogue of “the importance of truth being the goal of all dialogue and charity being the motivation behind all dialogue.” The content of the council’s meeting and the Pope’s statement seem to imply that religious dialogue is in need of guidelines to keep Catholic participants true to Church doctrine. But very few inter-faith dialogues deal with matters of deep theological import. Most are simply efforts to establish rapport and understanding.

Religious dialogues succeed or fail because of trust and respect. Achieving trust and respect takes time and dedication. Here is yet another example of a process which does not respond well to our need for instant gratification. Rabbis and priests in St. Louis have been in dialogue with each other for more than ten years. That dialogue would never have gotten off the ground had it not been for the personal bonds of friendship which existed between Father Vincent Heier, former Ecumenical officer of the St. Louis Archdiocese, and the late Rabbi Robert P. Jacobs, in his capacity as Executive Vice-president of the St. Louis Rabbinical Association. The two of them set out to create an atmosphere of dialogue which was faithful to the aspirations of the Vatican II process of reconciliation between Jews and Catholics.

We are still going strong. Every other month, a group of about twelve dialogue participants sit down to a kosher lunch provided by an anonymous donor, and over corned beef and turkey, hold a free-wheeling discussion. Sometimes the topics touch on clergy politics, i.e., “How do rabbis/priests get assigned to congregations? At other sessions, the news of the day may form the subject matter. For the most part the dialogue centers around an agreed upon topic with readings sent out in advance. Several sessions were devoted to a careful reading of Pope Benedict’s book, Jesus of Nazareth. Most recently the group studied fundamental documents of belief of the various expressions of Judaism, from Maimonides Thirteen Principles of Judaism to the latest platform of Reform Judaism. No question or comment is ever treated as off the subject. In fact, if there were a transcript of the proceedings it would read very much like a discussion in the Talmud.

Dialogue participants do not sugar-coat their questions or their responses. With the presence of Reform, Conservative and Orthodox rabbis, there is sometimes more intra-Jewish heat generated than heat between Jews and Catholics. Along the way there is significant learning and teaching which takes place. Our priests come to appreciate the wide range of Jewish responses to religious and moral questions of the day and our rabbis develop a more nuanced understanding of how the Church works in developing its teachings and public positions.

Just for the record, no one in these dialogues has converted anyone. Both sides remain true to their faith. What really takes place is a sorting out of real and imaginary differences. Not all or even most of the real differences can be bridged. The sages of Judaism believed that theological conflicts among rabbis were like sparks striking steel and resulted in illumination. I would include this image as a worthy description of true dialogues between persons of all faiths. For each participant there is a strengthening of faith.

http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/civil-religion/catholic/2008/06/rabbis-and-catholic-priests-in-dialogue/

Time Magazine: Re-Judaizing Jesus

The season of "Catholic" seders and various other mocking abominations unto God is upon us. The following article from Time magazine is an example of such.

Jesus was born to the tribe of Judah. He was not a Khazar and He did not subscribe to Rabbinism/Pharisaism which is exactly the idea that this article is intended to promote. It is intended to make us think that Jesus and St. Paul had a lot in common with the so-called "Jews" of our time who understand Jesus better than Christians ever did: Christians have not understood Jesus for 2000 years and we need the rabbis and their texts rotten with absurd fables, racial supremacism and self-worship in order to finally understand Him correctly. Pure delusion.

Re-Judaizing Jesus

DAVID VAN BIEMA - Time

Recently a popular blogger — let's call him Rabbi Ben — zinged the scholarship of a man we shall call Rabbi Rob. R. Ben claimed R. Rob did not "understand the difference between Judaism prior to the two Jewish wars in the 1st and 2nd centuries A.D. and later Mishnaic and Talmudic Judaism." He helpfully provided a syllabus.

Actually, neither man is a rabbi. (Sorry.) Ben Witherington is a Methodist New Testament scholar, and Rob Bell a rising Michigan megapastor. Yet each regards sources like the Mishnah and Rabbi Akiva as vital to understanding history's best-known Jew: Jesus.

This is seismic. For centuries, the discipline of Christian "Hebraics" consisted primarily of Christians cherry-picking Jewish texts to support the traditionally assumed contradiction between the Jews — whose alleged dry legalism contributed to their fumbling their ancient tribal covenant with God — and Jesus, who personally embodied God's new covenant of love. But today seminaries across the Christian spectrum teach, as Vanderbilt University New Testament scholar Amy-Jill Levine says, that "if you get the [Jewish] context wrong, you will certainly get Jesus wrong."

The shift came in stages: first a brute acceptance that Jesus was born a Jew and did Jewish things; then admission that he and his interpreter Paul saw themselves as Jews even while founding what became another faith; and today, recognition of what the Rev. Bruce Chilton, author of Rabbi Jesus, calls Jesus' passionate dedication "to Jewish ideas of his day" on everything from ritual purity to the ideal of the kingdom of God — ideas he rewove but did not abandon.

What does this mean, practically? At times the resulting adjustment seems simple. For example, Bell thinks he knows the mysterious words Jesus wrote in the dust while defending the adulteress ("He that is without sin among you, let him cast the first stone," etc.). By Bell's calculation, that showdown occurred at the same time as religious Jews' yearly reading of the prophet Jeremiah's warning that "those who turn from [God] will be written in the dust because they have forsaken [him]." Thus Jesus wrote the crowd's names to warn that their lack of compassion alienated their (and his) God.

A trickier revision for readers involves Paul's Letter to the Romans, forever a key Christian text on sin and Christ's salvific grace. Yet this reading necessitates skipping over what seems like extraneous material in Chapters 9 through 11, which are about the Jews. Increasingly, says Jason Byassee, an editor at the Christian Century,, scholars now read Romans through those chapters, as a musing by a lifelong Jew on how God can fulfill his biblical covenant with Israel even if it does not accept His son. Byassee the theologian agrees. But as a Methodist pastor, he frets that Romans "is no longer really about Gentile Christians. How do you preach it?"

That's not a frivolous query. Ideally, the reassessment should increase both Jewish-Christian amity and gospel clarity, things that won't happen if regular Christians feel that in rediscovering Jesus the Jew, they have lost Christ. Yet Bell finds this particular genie so logically powerful that he has no wish to rebottle it. Once in, he says, "you're in deep. You're hooked. 'Cause you can't ever read it the same way again."

http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1720049_1720050_1721663,00.html

More Signs of What to Expect from the October Synod

Background on this HERE and HERE. Apparently Cardinal Martini, who has called for this synod, intends that Christians learn from post-Temple rabbinic teaching. And note that Martini claims that the focus of this synod is to bring all things Catholic more into keeping with scripture--this even as it is reported that the scripture-based language of the Good Friday prayer for the conversion of the Jews from the 1962 Latin missal will be altered to suit modern, non-biblical sensibilities.

Italian cardinal hopes synod helps draw Catholics closer to Scripture

By Cindy Wooden

Catholic News Service--Jan-31-2008

ROME (CNS) -- Italian Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini, the retired archbishop of Milan and biblical scholar who repeatedly asked for a world Synod of Bishops on the Bible, said he hopes October's synod on the topic will focus on practical pastoral initiatives to bring Catholics closer to the Scriptures.

The Oct. 5-26 synod should be "a pastoral discernment" aimed at helping the church offer Catholics "authentic itineraries of worship, prayer and service" based on the Bible, he said in an article published in La Civilta Cattolica, a Jesuit journal reviewed by the Vatican prior to publication.

Cardinal Martini said the synod also should be an "examination of conscience" of how well the church has put into practice the teachings of the Second Vatican Council's document on divine revelation, "Dei Verbum."

A chapter of the synod outline or "lineamenta," published last April, focused on how the church nourishes itself with the word of God "in liturgy and in prayer, in evangelization and catechesis, in exegesis and in theology, and in the life of the believer," he said.

"I think that all of these areas are important and deserve the attention of the synod fathers," the cardinal said, particularly because too many Catholics still do not read the Bible on their own or in groups and only hear the Scriptures at Mass.

The cardinal said he hoped the synod would avoid "prolonged and abstract" discussions on matters already dealt with by the Second Vatican Council, such as the relationship between Scripture and tradition, or an examination of particular methods of biblical interpretation and scholarship.

Also, he said, focusing on "The Word of God in the Life and Mission of the Church," the synod's theme, the gathering should avoid placing an emphasis on "individual revealed truths," looking instead at the fact that God has revealed himself through the Scriptures.

Cardinal Martini said he hoped the synod would come up with concrete suggestions for bringing the Bible closer to the lives of Catholics.

He said his first suggestion would be that even at a daily Mass, where homilies usually are not given, the celebrant should offer a brief reflection -- "no longer than three minutes" -- on the day's Scripture readings.

A more difficult, but essential task, he said, is finding ways to help Catholics learn to pray with the Scriptures during their private prayers.

Cardinal Martini, who taught in Jerusalem and lives there much of the year, said the synod also must remind Catholics how much the Jewish tradition and modern Jewish scholarship have to teach them about the Bible, particularly the Old Testament.

"It is not enough to avoid any anti-Semitic feelings," he said. "One must reach the point of loving the Jewish people and all the expressions of their life and culture: their literature, art, folklore and religiousness. Only then can we establish those ties that will lead not only to overcoming mistrust and prejudices, but to collaborating for the good of humanity."

http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0800593.htm

Martini Lays Out the Plan

" ... it is necessary that ... communion be realized in all possible ways ... towards those Jews who began to codify the Mishnah at Yavneh and redacted the Talmud at Babylon, ... we must move towards a common goal when we shall be one single people ..."

Reflections Towards Jewish-Christian Dialogue

Carlo Maria Cardinal Martini

Rome, 4th November 2004 at the Pontifical Gregorian University

[Cardinal Martini is the Archbishop of Milan emeritus.]

Bruno Forte has outlined the fundamental elements of a Christian theology of Judaism that could give a positive reading of the relationship between Judaism and Christianity, without being tempted by extremist tendencies of an exclusivist nature (according to which Christianity has nothing to do with Judaism and would do better if it simply let go of any connection with the First Testament), or of an inclusivist bent (for which Christianity implies that God’s plan favoring the people of Israel has been replaced with another plan of salvation where Israel is not considered).

The wealth of data from his lecture has indicated that the problem is extremely complex – in fact, we are most likely only at the beginning of a radical theological re-thinking [of this question], in line with the indications that have come in a special way from the Second Vatican Council. This re-thinking, or re-appraisal, takes place only slowly, and especially requires time for its assimilation by local communities ...

... Today things are changing, but we need time and energy, even because new events in the history of our times give the virus of antisemitism the opportunity to spread and to give rise to condemnatory theories and judgments. In this perspective, I would like to answer the question: how can a local Church, given the existing negative stereotypes, help people to overcome them, and how can it develop a climate of friendly collaboration, respect and reciprocal esteem, which can in its turn provide the cultural background for a healthy theological re-appraisal?

The point is thus not only for specialists to discuss of the relations between Jews and Christians, but rather to find some points of reference for a common ecclesial agenda and for a dialogue between the Christian and the Jewish peoples that provides a background for the efforts of the theologians and the exegetes. What is at stake here is not merely the greater or lesser vitality of a dialogue, but something that concerns us Christians. We must make sure that the faithful gain a renewed awareness of their link with the children of Abraham, with all the resulting consequences for the doctrine, the discipline, the liturgy and the spiritual life of the Church, as well as her mission in the world of today ...

It is necessary to acquire an understanding of post-Biblical [Talmudic/Kabbalistic] Judaism, which, until very recently, was almost totally lacking in the Catholic Church. For this reason it is necessary – and I have said it more than once – not only to know the books and the traditions that after the destruction of the Temple continued to maintain in life a [specifically] Jewish hope, but also to widen our horizons to the entire history, the customs, the artistic, scientific, literary and musical talents of the Jewish people. It is thus necessary to cultivate an attitude of esteem and of love towards this people. Simple anti-antisemitism is not enough ... To this purpose, we shall have to organize numerous cultural initiatives. First of all, in the formation of the future priests it shall be necessary to emphasize the knowledge of Biblical and post-Biblical [Talmudic/Kabbalistic] Judaism. Over the last years, a certain progress has been made in this direction, but much remains to be done, especially because up to now only few have received this type of formation ...

Christian ethics and Jewish ethics are largely identical [!?!?!?!?] and pursue the same objectives. It is for this reason that it is possible for Jews and for Christians to work together in many fields and thus to establish those conditions of mutual trust which are the main road for an interreligious, intercultural and even political dialogue ...

To vivify our Eucharists, to celebrate the liturgy with all its precious values, the Christians ought to accustom themselves more and more to understand the prayers and the spirituality of Jews ...

Indeed for us, therefore, every day is an opportunity to begin to ask God and our brothers and sisters to accept our sorrow for the evil that we have done and the good that we have forgotten to accomplish. Let us humbly approach our Jewish brothers and sisters, the history of their suffering, of their martyrdom, of the persecutions that they have undergone. Let us remove the tendentious interpretations of passages included in the New Testament and in other writings ...

In the past, Judaism produced Talmudic reflection and all its attendant treatises. Now, it has established many thriving institutes that focus on research and on dialogue, in Jerusalem as well as in many other parts of the world. The Church cannot ignore the results of this elaboration, as they are presented in the religious, juridical and philosophical texts of post-biblical Jewish literature. I am convinced that a deeper understanding of Judaism and its currents is vital for the Church, not only so as to overcome a centuries-old ignorance and to begin a fruitful dialogue, but also to deepen the understanding that the Church has of itself. In other words, I would like to emphasize the importance, for the theology of Christian praxis, of the study of the problems derived from the interruption of the contribution that the theology and the praxis of Jewish-Christians was giving to the early Christian community. It is a fact that the first great schism, that between Jews and Christians, has deprived the Church of the help it would have received from the Jewish tradition ...

... we must begin to propose shared values, so as to discover [new] aims and instruments of dialogue, knowing that in this way we are doing a service to humanity as a whole. In this dialogue the city of Jerusalem has a fundamental importance ...

The fifth stage is that of initiatives at the academic level, as well as at the level of school formation. The introduction to Jewish religiosity and culture can be fostered in a variety of ways. At the academic level, one might promote encounters and research projects, coordinating what already exists; in the schools, one might use the possibilities foreseen by the school laws and revising the textbooks. A further possibility would be the organization of re-training courses for the clergy and the catechists, and the establishment of such classes in the seminaries and the dioceses.

... the last stage, which is the creation of meeting points and of ambits of social, political and cultural collaboration. [emphasis supplied]...

If we Christians believe that we are in continuity and in communion with the patriarchs, the prophets, those exiled to Babylon and the Maccabean martyrs, it is necessary that this communion be realized in all possible ways, also towards those Jews who began to codify the Mishnah at Yavneh and redacted the Talmud at Babylon, ... we must move towards a common goal when we shall be one single people that the Lord shall bless, saying: “Blessed be Egypt, my people, Assyria, work of my hands, Israel, my inheritance” (Is 19:25).

A second objective is that of common service to the same project of covenant. Both Jews and Christians are called to carry out a service towards humanity as a whole. This service constitutes a ministry that can effectively be called priestly, a mission that can unite us without dissolving our individual identities, until the coming of the Messiah, [!!!!] whom we invoke with the words Marana-tha.

If we want to try and describe this priestly ministry of Israel [!!!!] and the Church, we can use the category of “sanctifying His name,” in other words, the decision to make the holiness of God present in ourselves, in families, in society, in creation. Judaism has developed a careful reflection on the precepts that sanctify every moment of life and on the intention of the heart that constitutes its vivifying soul.

If the Christian Church feels called, especially in Europe, to be a critical conscience of society, it shall always find the support of the profound religious and ethical teachings of Judaism. If the Church wishes to promote everywhere the dialogue of peace and to be a universal meeting place of all people in the name of Christ, in whom all things shall be recapitulated, it is especially with regard to Judaism that this dialogue and this peace are first of all to be promoted. Jews and Christians, in full respect for the diversity of the specific content of their faiths, must set out to accomplish this fraternal collaboration with intensity and depth; the more they succeed in this task, the more meaningful their presence shall be for the Europe of the third millennium and for the role that Europe has towards the rest of the world.

Full lecture:
http://www.bc.edu/research/cjl/meta-elements/texts/center/conferences/Bea_Centre_C-J_Relations_04-05/Martini.htm

Pope: Pharisaism Endures as Talmudic Judaism

Newsweek has published an except from Benedict XVI's new book, Jesus of Nazareth which he has earlier stated is written as a dialog with Rabbi Jacob Neusner. Here is a quote from that excerpt:

The Sadducees disappeared after the destruction of Jerusalem (a.d. 70), whereas the pattern of life practiced by the Pharisees found an enduring form in the sort of Judaism shaped by the Mishnah and the Talmud. Although we observe sharp antagonism between Jesus and the Pharisees in the Gospels, and although his death on the Cross was the very antithesis of the Zealot program, we must not forget that people came to Christ from every kind of background and that the early Christian community included more than a few priests and former Pharisees. (Pope Benedict XVI, Jesus of Nazareth, p.13)

We have already shown from Neusner's writings that Judaism is the codified religion of the Pharisees and now we see the same from Benedict XVI. Only a few years ago this was viewed as the controversial, "antisemitic" thesis of Michael A. Hoffman. Now we see it frankly stated as a matter of fact by the Pope in the mainstream press.

What is happening here? This is likely meant to control the public reaction to revelations of hitherto little known facts pertaining to Judaism which are flooding the internet lately. This is also likely an attempt to deepen the double minded hypnosis of those who observe it.

In recent years we have witnessed Benedict telling us that the rabbis of Talmudic Judaism are "our elder brothers in the faith." He has stated that the Judaic (see: Talmudic) interpretation of scripture which denies Christ is a valid interpretation. He has met with Talmudic rabbis almost daily to confirm his mission to create deeper religious relations between Catholicism and Talmudic Judaism. He's visited Talmudic synagogues. He has often expressed his deep respect for Talmudic Judaism. And now he tells us that Talmudic Judaism is the religion of the Pharisees whom Jesus had a sharp antagonism with in the Gospel. Could there be a more double minded message from this man?




Benedict XVI at the Synagogue of Cologne where he made the following outrageous statement:

In considering the Jewish roots of Christianity (cf. Rom 11: 16-24), my venerable Predecessor, quoting a statement by the German Bishops, affirmed that "whoever meets Jesus Christ meets Judaism" (Insegnamenti, Vol. III/2, 1980, p. 1272).

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/speeches/2005/august/documents/hf_ben-xvi_spe_20050819_cologne-synagogue_en.html

I beg to differ. Anyone who meets Judaism meets the doctrine which Jesus Christ told His disciples to beware of. Benedict testifies against Himself.

Look well and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees ... Then they understood that he said not they should beware of the leaven of bread, but of
the doctrine of Pharisees and Sadducees. (Matthew 16;6-12)